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| Daedalus and Icarus by van Dyck |
Ever thought of what it would be like to fly in the sky, soaring high with the birds? Ever imagined what it would feel like to have wings? How about to fly high above the sea to escape with your life? This is what Daedalus and his son, Icarus, hoped to accomplish in the dead of night to escape from the deadly wrath of the Minotaur, a mythological of beast from Greek that was half-bull, half-man, in the Labyrinth with wings constructed from feathers and wax. In the story, Daedalus sketched out a wing design for the feathers to be applied to. Then, using that design, build a wooden lattice in the shape of an outstretched wing and covered it from feathers that he had gathered, making them stick to the framework with heated wax. He attached the wings to his and Icarus’ arms, and then took off over the sea. However, despite his father’s warning, Icarus flew too close to the sun, where the heat then melted the wax keeping the feathers to the frame, and he plunged into the sea and drowned. But is a flight such as this possible? Can we as humans really fly as the birds in the sky do, flapping our own set of wings and soaring on air currents? What needed physics would behind this to make it possible?
Tell me your thoughts and ideas. Be sure to give detail on why.
While flying like Icarus and Daedalus did would be very interesting, it would also be, unfortunately, impossible. Firstly, the human musculature is unable, without aid, to provide the amount of strength to flap wings and support itself. As the body gets stronger, and closer to being able to flap the wings like this, the body also becomes heavier, and thus needs to be even stronger, adding yet more weight, and needs to be stronger... It's a paradox. A Frenchman named Besnier was rumored to have flown a personal aircraft made of taffeta and wood, but he also used pulleys to multiply his strength; not to mention that this story is only a rumor, having never been proven. Second, assuming the wax that Daedalus used in construction is similar to modern wax, it would have a melting point of around 130 degrees farenheit. To reach a temperature this high, a person would have to reach the lower levels of the thermosphere, the uppermost layer of our atmosphere. A person using such crude technology as wooden and wax wings could not possibly have created a suit enabling them to survive through the -100 degree temps that would be found in the mesosphere, and other levels of the atmosphere above our own troposhere, where the weather can become very uncomfortable, and unsurvivable without respirating equipment, meaning Icarus was more likely to have frozen to death than to have fallen with melted wings. So, unfortunately, the story of Icarus and Daedalus cannot be possible, and it probably wouldn't be possible for us today either. But who really needs wooden wings when we'll have jet-packs in just a few more years, right? Not to mention scramjets and all the other science-fiction-y aircraft that are around right now.
ReplyDeletealso, great choice of topics. It is really a no-brainer question, but it prompts you to think about physics, and that "Iron Maiden" song, in a way that I never really had before.
ReplyDeletehmmm. the way icarus did it i dont think it possible. because the wings would have to be more massive than your body n your body can only exert so much force for so long, no man could even lift such a force. if its with pulleys its pretty much the same story but i think pulleys would help with making a stronger force and lasting longer. its impossible you would have to be inhuman to stay in flight.
ReplyDeleteYes, a flight such as this such be possible, if flown farther away from the sun. Although i cannot think of exact examples, the idea seems plausible.
ReplyDeleteLeonardo Da Vin chi did a few experiments and said if you considered it like a sparrow or a bat where you had to rapidly flap the wings, you will plummet. although if you were to act as if you used a frame work of an eagle where you didn't have to exert so much force into the wings, and you would be able to glide through the sky.then it may be possible to "glide" through the sky. By the way one of my favorite Greek tales.
ReplyDeleteBack then i don't think that this woldv'e been possible. but with the technology and knowledge of physics today something could probably be done. It obviously wouldn't work if you just make some wings out of feathers and strap them on your back. more of a gliding action might be more possible.
ReplyDeletenerdman says it is not possible to fly because you cant fly that close to the sun, it is impossible..BOOM!
ReplyDeleteya..i have thought about making myself a set of wings. yes i agree with nerdman, it is impossible. the sun is to "hawt"..but it might be possible if you had a real set of wings.ROASTED!
ReplyDeleteAnother reason why this could not be possible is the fact that the human body is not designed for flight. Look at a bird for example, the type of bird built for flight, their bodies are small, their bones are strong but thin, and the way they fly is very different. If you look at a bird closely while it is flying you can see that it is not just flapping its wings much like you would think. The wings are actually rotating on the shoulder blades. This way the wings actually generate an upward thrust. You can check out how this works by looking up an Ornithoper, which works on the same priniple. Even if it is possiple to take off with these wax/feather wings it would be impossiple for a human to sustain flight. We are just not built for it.
ReplyDeleteI think it is impossible to have a set of wings and fly if you are a human. Don't get me wrong, I've tried to fly when I was a young lad, but that didn't work out to well. Birds have a wayy smaller body then us human doing. We have body fat, they don't. Maybe if America wasn't a bustly body type, we could fly. Birds are just smaller and can fly and we can't. Thats my own opinion at least :D
ReplyDeleteThank you all for the wonderful comments and you all had great reason and feedback on your answer. And thank you for the nice comments on the topic, I'm happy you enjoy it! Many of you said that it would be impossible to construct a set of wings made from simple feathers and wax, which is understandable.
ReplyDeleteFrom us as humans to construct a set of wings from these things and then attach them to our arms would be practically impossible. However, as some of you mentioned, it might be possible in this day and age using perhaps different materials and wings designs. Maybe a stronger adhesive or tighter, more flexible material would do the trick.
Also a lot of you pointed out that we do not have the proper body to fly, using the example of a bird as what would be appropriate.
A bird's body is constructed for flight while ours are not. Humans are much heavier then birds and also are not built for the rapid speed that a bird flaps its wings at. Birds bones are hollow, making them even lighter. Also, while birds are naturally born with wings, we would have to attach wings to our limbs that were not originally made for flying.
Many of you mentioned gliding might be possible and this is a very good thought. Birds wings are made specially to be able to give the power to propel themselves upward and most birds have to continuously beat their wings to keep in flight. Since humans are not made this way, to have wings made to be that same as birds does not seem like a good idea. Hang gliders are a perfect example of human flight. We are able to glide through the air and control are direction by shifting our weight.
It would be interesting, but you would need a lot more feathers on it depending on the size of the wooden lattice. It would be possible in today's time because of our technology.
ReplyDeleteLiterally flying as a bird would seems quite impossible. Humans simply aren't made to fly, we dont have the arm strengh to flap large wings or the ablility to stay that long off the ground, if we were, we would have wings. it seems like with todays technology thou, something could be made for humans to fly, but if it was, wouldnt someone have already done it?
ReplyDeleteI think that if there was a way to fly, someone would have figured it out already. I agree with Physics123, in saying that with the advancements in technology that there probably is some way to achieve flight.
ReplyDeleteBack then i dont think it was possible to fly like birds. But now with all the new techonolgy these days there may be a way to come up with away to fly like a bird.
ReplyDeleteAs all you have said, with the technology we posses today, we might be able to achieve flight and, as Nero Darkstar as said, that we are not built to fly as birds do.
ReplyDeleteIn relative to what Chip said and as Mickey B has pointed out and as well as others have mentioned, Leonardo Da Vinci did come up with the theory that flight for humans might be possible if it were gliding instead of flapping wings
If you look at Leonardo Da Vinci's prototypes for flight it is actually very interesting. I watched a documentary on it once and it claimed that he had the physics for his bird wings figured out right, however he didn't realize how ill suited a human was for flying with wings being so heavy. Da Vinci also designed and built a prototype for a helicopter. The design of a helicopter by the way uses non real numbers. The show claimed that he had everything right. The only thing wrong was that he didn't have light enough materials that we have today that would have made it work. In short Leonardo Da Vinci was genius and way ahead of his time. Flight is a very interesting matter.
ReplyDeletebut even gliding wouldn't really be possible for humans without an elaborate framework, and certainly not by just attaching wings to your arms. California condors, the masters of gliding, can have wingspans of 9 and a half feet or more, but their bodies are only around 4 feet long. A human, taking for granted they are around six feet tall, would have to have a 12 foot wingspan to maintain the same ratio neccesary for gliding, far longer than anyones arms. they would look like an orangutan See photo http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Pongo_pygmaeus_(orangutang).jpg
ReplyDeleteI think it is impossible to fly like this. It is very unprobable. The wings would have to be perfect dimensions and everything would have to be just right.
ReplyDeletea wingsuit can be used to help sustain flight, and they were originally used in the 1930's. if time and effort were spent on trying to perfect the wingsuit, then i believe that humans could actually learn to glide and land safely with only a wingsuit. although gliding is not technically flying, it would be a step in the right direction. because what comes up must come down, and if we perfected the wing suit we would only have to worry about the up!
ReplyDeleteA flight like this wouldn't be possible. With how much humans weigh, plus the added weight of the wooden frame and feathers and wax for the wings, a normal air current couln't support it. If there were winds like when there are tornados, then i'm sure people could fly--it wouldn't be pleasant and you couldn't control where you're going though.
ReplyDeleteIn response to rosedesire: you are right but remember that we are not built the same as birds. Birds bones are hollow, making them lighter. And with what hraldo said, there are such things are wingsuits. They are made to guild like a flying squirrel, material stretched between the arms and legs. Also, rosedesire and Nibz are right that a perfect design for a wing structure would have to be made for humans to fly, which makes in nearly impossible for humans to fly with the wings of a bird.
ReplyDeleteAnd in response to Goat, you are absolutely right. A air current could not support the weight of a human and make it possible for a bird-like flight. I like the tornado bit too!
i think that it may be possible if he flew farther away from the sun but also think that the wings would be to heavy for him to accomplish this task. it is a an experiment that i think could go either way.
ReplyDeleteThanks for the great comments this week!
ReplyDeleteThe distance you fly at away from the sun really doesn't matter. You have an infinitely higher probability of freezing to death as you get farther from the Earth than you do burning up as you get closer to the Sun. And wings are just too heavy; you couldn't flap, or more rotate as "Chicken Joe" said for nearly long enough of strong enough to get airborne. Sadly, wings just aren't a plausible method for flight. You're better off saving up for a jet pack or a personal helicopter, Nadara, than attempting this experiment that "...could go either way." Seriously, worst case scenario: you die; best case scenario: you waste a lot of time and are disappointed.
ReplyDeleteSorry to burst your bubble, everyne who said it might be possible, but it's not. Better try something else. Flying, or physics for that matter, just isn't going to work out for you. Sorry.